The Freelancer and the eCommerce Giant: Navigating Amazon Selling with Vicki Weinberg

Speaker 1: 0:51

You're listening to, the future is freelance podcast, the show for digital nomads and slow maths consultants, remote workers, residents and everyone living a life without traditional boundaries. We're here for people who defy categorization and make a living and a life their own way. Every freelance Friday, we bring you expert tips, inspired insights and stories from the frontiers of freelancing to help you achieve success with your borderless business, whatever success means to you as you live life on your own terms. Now we're coming towards the end of season four. If you're listening to this around the release date, we're even coming up towards the end of 2023. So our thoughts are turning to Christmas, a new year, to planning for the future and, hopefully, to taking a little bit of downtime as we go about that shift between the seasons and the year. I hope that, even as freelancers, you're planning some time off, because it's really important and, of course, the other thing that we think about this time of year is gifts and giving and parcels and sending things to our loved ones. That's why I particularly wanted to bring you this episode today where we dig into the mysteries of Amazon selling. My guest today has been there, seen it, done it. She started with her own product range on Amazon, and now she specializes in helping other people to get started and to succeed and then to optimize and fine tune to make the very most of selling on Amazon and other online platforms. Now, before I start the interview, I wanted to let you know that, just because we're into December now, we are not done here at the Future is freelance. We do have one more episode coming for you next week and that's going to be a very special one, telling you about big changes coming up at Remote Work Europe. Now, I know a lot of people listening to this will be based in Europe and you might well be part of our community already. We are launching something amazing just for you in the new year, so I will put the links in the show notes here so that you can make sure you're on our distribution list so that you do not miss it once we go live with this on the 14th of December. And in the meantime, just make sure that you're subscribed to the Future is freelance podcast and, as we said with Vicki, if you feel like reviewing us and rating us, that does amazing things to inspire and encourage a small business. Loads of other knowledge bombs coming your way in this interview with Vicki Weinberg, so I hope you enjoy it as much as I did. So, vicki, welcome to the Future. Is freelance. It's great to have you with us.

Speaker 2: 3:19

Thank you. Thank you for inviting me.

Speaker 1: 3:21

Well, we're really looking forward to learning all about what you do and what you offer to help freelancers and other businesses, but first of all, we'd love to know how you got there, because we find people's stories, and their their own back stories, absolutely fascinating. So please tell us a little bit about your journey.

Speaker 2: 3:36

Sure, it's quite a long story, so I hope that's okay. Okay, if it gets to rambling, I'll give you the short version. So I had a corporate career and then, following the birth of my first child, I decided to step away from that and start my own business and I became a yoga teacher. And that was something I did for a couple of years. And then I had my second child and I couldn't work during that pregnancy because of some issues I was having, and so I still had my yoga business, but there were people sort of you know, working in the business for me. I was just doing payroll, I guess, and that wasn't really suited me. I was looking for something else to do and I came across the idea of selling my own brand of products. I had a little bit of time and headspace not much because I had two small children, but I did have a bit of time. Slowly, slowly, I started up my own brand of products and sold them on Amazon. That business did really well. Alongside that, I launched a blog where I was sort of sharing about what I was doing and what I was learning like in real time, thinking that might be helpful, and I started getting people contact me with the back of that, saying, oh, I'm really interested in what you're doing, I'd quite like to sell products, and you know how do you find suppliers or how do you get this up on Amazon or whatever it is. And then eventually I just started thinking maybe I should be asking for money for all this free advice that I'm happily giving out. So I set myself up on a freelancing platform and that, yeah, that really is the biggest. That's a short version of that, so that really is the beginning of what I do now.

Speaker 1: 5:06

Okay, well, that's brilliant. There's lots. I want to come back to there and unpick, but give us the nutshell of what your work looks like now. Then what is your main business?

Speaker 2: 5:16

So I help businesses mainly small businesses sell their products on Amazon. So I help businesses who want to get started. So they've already got a business and products, usually their own website. Maybe they're selling in some other places too, but they're looking at Amazon as an extra marketplace and they want some help getting started. And then I also work with businesses who are selling on Amazon already, but perhaps things things aren't quite what they'd like, so maybe sales aren't where they'd like them to be, or maybe they're having some sort of issue on the platform, or maybe they just need a hand because everything takes so much time and they're just looking for someone to delegate some of it to.

Speaker 1: 5:52

Yes, well, I'm sure somebody who's figured out the way to do that in a streamlined way can save them time just by applying what you've learned from experience. But going back to your, your original journey selling them, was that yoga related products and things or babies? It wasn't it was baby products.

Speaker 2: 6:09

It was kind of inspired by my yoga journey because I'm the yoga brand, so I'm the business. I had them was it was part. I bought a franchise and as part of the franchise they sold yoga clothes which I didn't actually sell because I wasn't interested in that in that side of it At the time. I was just interested in the classes but in learning about the products. All their products are made from bamboo, so I learned about bamboo as a fabric. So then when I went to look at creating my own baby products, bamboo was a product that I thought of because you know, I become aware of it and a lot of the benefits for exercise like it keeping you cool when you need to be or keeping warm I thought actually this was work really well for babies as well, for, you know, regulating temperature and things. So all of my products were made from bamboo.

Speaker 1: 6:54

Brilliant, so you got those products made specifically for you. They were your. It was your own product line that you were selling originally.

Speaker 2: 7:02

Yes, it was so. I designed the product with the help of people who know what they're doing. You know I was sketching things on notebooks and then working with product designers to actually get them to look how I, how I envisaged them, and I did all of this. I should say I did all this really, really cheap. In the beginning I was working with freelancers to get all of this set up, and then I was going out and looking for manufacturers and it was a bit scrappy, if I'm honest.

Speaker 1: 7:27

You did have two young children at the time. I did.

Speaker 2: 7:30

And I didn't know what I was doing. But I got there, which I think is great and and and yeah, the business is really really well and actually it was from when I started putting my products on Amazon, because at first I started off I had a shop if I store, and I would do like the local baby markets and things close to where I live but it's when I put the products on Amazon that I actually started to see real growth and sales. You know a level where it was providing an income.

Speaker 1: 7:57

That's really interesting. So it started off as more of a local business, because I suppose something like that a new fabric and a new, a new line people want to see it and touch it. I can understand the instinct to want to start your sales that way, but then you shifted to the platform selling. Now this is the thing that interests a lot of freelancers because of the idea that you can do it from anywhere, that even if you have a physical product, you don't have to supply it directly and go down to the post office with your packages every day. So what was what was that shift like? And can I just check in sort of roughly when that was in terms of what it might be like now versus then?

Speaker 2: 8:38

So I think it was 2017. It was a while ago and that's a good question, because things have changed a bit since then. I tell people that starting on Amazon now is harder than when I did it, purely because there's just so many more sellers now because, as it grows in, popularity is somewhere I don't know who's going to pop out somewhere to buy from. I feel like it's always been popular, but certainly as a marketplace to sell products. I just that I've got I can't even remember the statistics that you'd be amazed at the amount of new sellers that sign up every single day. So it's just gets more and more competitive. And then, of course, those that have been on there 10 years, five years. I've got a bit of an advantage because they've got all that history built up. So it does get tougher and tougher, which I guess in a way, for my business, is great because it gives me. Basically there is a need for people who know what they're doing, who can help. But then I do also feel. I do also feel for people who have great products and they have a perfect fit, but they're struggling to get going because it's not it's never anything they're doing, it's just the fact that it's just got so competitive, I do feel for people, because yeah, it is. It is a really hard marketplace to get into what can be.

Speaker 1: 9:48

I suppose that's like anything, isn't it? Like coaching, podcasting, writing, whatever else you do you look around and think that would be a great business model, but actually there are so many people doing it, but cutting through and actually being visible is something that's so much harder to do. So you started doing this in 2017 and you mentioned that while you were doing it, you were blogging as well. So, part of that learning out loud, you did say that you found some of your early efforts more scrappy and experimental, but you were sharing that as you went along. I'm really interested, as a content creator myself, what difference you feel that made in your sales and your message and your positioning the fact that you were blogging at the same time.

Speaker 2: 10:31

I think it probably did help with visibility because I think because I was blogging and so there was a while I was and I was blogging at least once a week, so that I feel like that probably helps and I didn't know much about SEO and things like that then, but actually it probably helped in terms of I was creating content consistently, so that was really good in terms of people finding me. I don't know that it did much for my product sales, but it definitely was a spark for me starting my own business because people were finding me and asking questions and that was kind of like I said the original seed, where I was like okay, people are actually interested in what I'm doing, what I can do to help them. And I think as well, there's always a thing at the beginning where you feel like I can't take money off someone to help them with this because I'm not an expert. Who am I to charge for this? But once I realized that actually I didn't need to be the expert back then I just needed to be able to help the person, I was genuinely help them. You know, I would never take on work if I couldn't do it, or someone asked me a question I didn't know. I would always say, actually I don't know. But I think when I genuinely could help someone, I really had to make a mind shift, shift into actually it's okay to for someone to pay me to help them with the problem they're having, if I can solve it, if that makes sense.

Speaker 1: 11:46

Absolutely, but that's, that's a kind of imposter syndrome, isn't it? That sort of who am I to set myself up as this and then needing to be reminded by real life that if you, if you figured out something, you're one step ahead and you can actually give even give somebody that shortcut to information and expertise that's probably out there in the public domain because you found it, but you found it the hard way and you figured it out. Now you can package that up and offer it to somebody else. They can go straight to where you are now in terms of expertise. Then that's an asset, right.

Speaker 2: 12:20

Absolutely, and that's something I was really. That's kind of. The point of the blog was for people to avoid making all of the mistakes that I did.

Speaker 1: 12:27

Yes. Well, I think that's very courageous to put that out there and to share the mistakes as well as the triumphs. Let's face it, business is never a straight line to infinite success, whatever Some people would like you to believe. And it's much more honest and authentic to share the things that you would have done differently or what the lessons that you learned as you went along and so on, and now you're helping other people to do that. So I think also there's a little bit of just kind of busting the mystique of the platforms as well. Certainly with Amazon, maybe it's different after the pandemic and I'm sure that shifted a lot of people's relationship with that brand in particular. But there's this sense of parcels arriving by magic. Maybe people don't realise as much that there are private sellers on there as well as the Amazon fulfilled product lines. You mentioned that that number is growing all the time. Have you any idea what sort of proportion that is?

Speaker 2: 13:22

Oh, it's huge and I really wish I had the figures in front of me, but there were thousands of new sellers every day. And you're right, I think as a customer you don't really understand and it nor should you have to understand sort of how it all works and there is a bit of mystique about it. And also, if I'm gonna be really candid, I also feel like Amazon themselves don't make it very Transparent, because I think that's something a lot of struggle is as well. Struggle is a lot of sellers struggle with is that, especially if they're new, you know nothing seems to make sense. The whole way everything's set up and how you have to go about getting things done. It always surprises people. Yeah, it's my as well at the beginning.

Speaker 1: 13:59

I'm sure from a right at the point of view. I've worked with the traditional publisher, who has nothing good to say about Amazon because obviously it's massively encroached on Her business and made life extremely difficult and complicated and chipped away every margin everywhere. And then, on the other side, self-publishing it's so incredibly easy and democratizing the fact that anybody can publish anything by uploading a file and of course, that creates an awful lot of noise and rubbish out there as well. That was even before we had AI generated content. So on the physical product side, I'm sure it's the same that you're competing against People from all over the world with lower costs, lower quality. Has that been a growing problem?

Speaker 2: 14:42

I think so. I'm thinking, though, that a lot maybe, but a lot of customers maybe getting a bit more savvy, because if you buy something on Amazon, it says it's going to turn up in three weeks. You probably couldn't tell that's not. Yeah, amazon have also added as the opportunity to have a small business badge on your listing as well, to show that you're a small business, which I personally really like because, as you were saying, I think that it's it's a really like. As for self-publish office, I think it's a really good opportunity for really small brands to get their products in front of loads of people. Potentially, of course, you have to. It's not just a case of listing your products and everyone finds it and buys it if only with that simple it is really. I think it can. It can for the right products, sort of make you know it could be put you on another level in terms of visibility and customers being able to find you and you know You're listed on there alongside some of the bigger brands and you have just as much of a chance of us getting a sale as they do. I think that side a bit for small businesses is really really good.

Speaker 1: 15:39

Yeah, that's exciting, isn't it?

Speaker 2: 15:41

alongside them. It is and something I say to people a lot is I feel like it's a lot easier to get a sale on Amazon. Then it is on your own website, because we've all you know I don't I'm not an SEO expert, as I said earlier about it I know that it is a lot of hard work to get people to your website and then you have to have your website constructed in such a way that people buy from you, and I could say I'm not an expert in that side of things. Where I was on Amazon, people are there to shop. So if they're looking for what you're selling, I really like that side a bit. That you know that's the intent of people being on there. They're not. They're looking for solutions, or well, maybe they are, but they're looking for products as a solution. They're not just looking for information, like they might be on Google, they're actually looking to buy. So I feel like by being there, I think that gives you a bit more of an opportunity as well.

Speaker 1: 16:29

That's brilliant insight. Yes, we've got an interview coming up before the end of the year about freelance gigging on Upwork, and it's that same Shift that the people there are there because they want to spend money on a thing and they're looking for someone to solve a problem and that they're prepared to invest in, and it's the same. If somebody comes to Amazon, it's not because they're looking for information. They're not looking to confirm something they already knew. They're not looking to read about something. They're looking to hit that buy button, I guess. So, provided you're there In the right place, that's perfect. But obviously it's Amazon's button, it's Amazon's cart, it's Amazon's platform. We hear a lot of people talking about not building your business on somebody else's business, that they can change the rules or take it away, ban you for some infraction, what? What's your thoughts about the dominance of Amazon and any vulnerabilities of Instructing your entire e-commerce empire on their rails?

Speaker 2: 17:27

Well, first of all, I would definitely Recommend not having your whole business on Amazon, for a few reasons. Well, what one? For the reason you've just said. It's like you know, you hear about people getting kicked off Instagram and places like that. Your listings can get suppressed or removed on Amazon and often, you know, I see this happen really regularly, where some Amazon closes down someone's listing and they haven't done anything wrong. And I'll give a real example. So last week I had a client who had their listing closed down because Amazon said it was a pesticide, but what they were selling was so, which is clearly not a pesticide, and I was able you know I was able to get it sorted out. I knew I'd be able to get it sorted out because of how daft it was. However it's it does, it wasn't a case of me just phoning, say. By the way, you've made a mistake. It did take a little bit of time and a little bit of effort to get that resolved. If Amazon was just the only place they were selling, they would have lost a couple of days sales and, to be honest, they probably did still lose an amount of sales, because not everyone will go oh, I was looking for this brand and I can't find it anymore. I go and see their website, but I feel like having your own platform. If someone's looking for your product in particular and they don't find you on Amazon, they do have the opportunity, particularly if they bought from you before. They do have the opportunity to then go and Google you and go to buy to your own website. So there are always those customers who, even if they see a product on Amazon, if they've never heard of the brand, they will go and look them up to see if this is a real company. Do they have a website? So that's another reason I recommend always having a site, I think. Yet the main reason is that, yes, I still think your sales would be affected if your Amazon account or your listings were closed or suppressed for some reason. However, I think having your own website is a contingency for those customers who really want to buy from you, really want to find you. They will still come and find you. So I think having your own website is essential and also you might want to. It might not just be Amazon, your own website, you might have other sales channels as well. I mean, I don't recommend being doing everything up once, and what I mean by that is a mistake I made when I started my businesses. I had a website and then I stopped it on Amazon and then I decided I was going to be on eBay and then a few other Marketplaces and it was just a lot and I feel like I was spreading my efforts too thin and I think, if you're going to commit to a marketplace like Amazon, that takes a bit of works to get right. I think maybe websites the first thing, because that's the basis of your business and then one marketplace at a time, and focus on doing it really well and trying to be everywhere.

Speaker 1: 19:52

Well, they've all got their quirks and nuances, haven't they? Which is why it adds value for people to retain somebody like you who's got that figured out with Amazon and knows what to do when you get a product. I'm fairly kicked off. For example, it might have taken that client a lot longer to figure that out for themselves. And all that time it's offline, they're losing sales. I suppose this time of year too, this is not yet.

Speaker 2: 20:16

It's not a great time of year for this sort of thing to happen, which is why one thing I'd recommend to be recording this the end of November, and I do recommend to all of my clients If you've got things you want to be selling for Christmas, I'm have it, you know, done way ahead of now, really by middle of November if possible. You want everything set up and Good to go so you're not worried about getting things approved or any issues that you know. Hopefully, if everything's in place early enough, you'll get through this season. You know I was game as it were.

Speaker 1: 20:47

We all need a good Christmas this year, don't we?

Speaker 2: 20:51

Your clients are going to get one.

Speaker 1: 20:52

There are a couple of other problems I've heard from people who have tried to break into Amazon selling, maybe without the benefit of your experience and expertise. One of them is their designs getting ripped off. I worked with somebody who was doing dropshipping and to print on demand T-shirts and things like that. She'd come up with amazing designs, really topical slogans, and then within 24 hours, anything that was selling well was duplicated by a seller on the other side of the world who could undercut her pricing and rush something out and stick a lot of ad budget behind it. Is that anything you can do to protect your ideas in that way on a platform like Amazon?

Speaker 2: 21:31

That's really frustrating, isn't it? But I don't like it when I hear about things like that happening. First of all and it does happen, sadly so there are things you can do. So you can apply for something called brand registry on Amazon, which is where you register your brand, and it's free. You just need a trademark, in whichever country you're looking to sell in, and you can register for Amazon's brand registry, and then you've got some protection. If you see someone else selling something that appears to be a replica of your product, you can then contact Amazon and ask for the other listing to be removed. I will be really honest, though, that, as of everything on Amazon and I always hate saying this, but it is true, it doesn't not everything is immediate. So, even if the problem is really obvious, the solution is very obvious. The seller support isn't what I would like it to be and what I think everyone else would like it to be, in that sometimes some of this can be a bit of an effort to resolve, but it is all resolvable, and that's actually something I'll say about working, I think. Another thing I think my clients benefit from working with me is because I've been there and done it and seen it all. I do know what can be resolved and what can't and, by the way, 99% of things can. There's very, very few times where I've said actually I don't think we're going to get anywhere with this. Most of the time things can be, but it can seem very bleak. So I think that's. The other thing about working with someone who's got a lot of experience is that I know sometimes a client will come to me and they're very despondent because something's happened, maybe a listing's been pulled, and I know that I can fix it, whereas to them it perhaps looks quite hopeless because oh, they've never come up against it before, and I suppose it must feel very powerless as one sort of solo entrepreneur up against the vast global machine that is Amazon.

Speaker 1: 23:18

Where do you even start?

Speaker 2: 23:20

And even if you're a slightly bigger business, because the support for sellers, as I say, is not wonderful and that's an understatement. It can feel a bit like yeah, it can feel like a bit like they're against you rather than with you. And as much as I hate saying that, I do like to say it because it takes people by surprise, because the support when you're a customer is pretty good. I've never had an issue where I haven't had a refund or been able to return something, whatever it is. I've always been sorted out, my parcel's got put in the wrong place, it's always been fine. But as a seller, it's just. The level of support isn't that good, and I always like to share that when I'm talking about Amazon, just so people know it's not them, like it's nothing personal, it's not them, it's not their business.

Speaker 1: 24:04

You're not sugarcoating anything. Clearly it's part of your brand. Value is obviously to be very honest about that and what can and can't be done and how you can help people. You have to work within the tools they give you, I suppose, and if that's not great, then that's a value add where you can help people. And the other problem it was actually the same person I was talking to earlier this year who had her t-shirts designs ripped off was that some of the sellers who were doing that to her were flooding the place with fake reviews. Now I know that's a problem on a lot of different platforms for buying, selling products and services, but do you think Amazon's got a handle on this? Has it got worse recently? Can anything be done?

Speaker 2: 24:47

You can again. You can report reviews, particularly if you think they're false. Amazon do try and clamp down on reviews themselves, so I've had clients who've had reviews removed because Amazon have felt that they were fake reviews. So it does happen. It does happen. They are trying to cut down on it. They're trying to really tighten how you get reviews. So it's almost it's almost, but I feel like it's we've almost gone. There's almost the other problem as well. It's almost impossible to get reviews because you can't ask people for them. It's so hard to ask. We used to get to email people and ask for reviews, but now 99% of customers don't want that, so they've turned that off. That used to be something customers couldn't remove, but now most of them do so. If you buy on Amazon now, you probably see you get all of those emails about your orders being dispatched, et cetera, but you won't get the one saying please leave me a review, because those don't come out anymore. So, as a seller, I think you almost have the other problem, which means if you're a seller struggling to get reviews and you can see someone with all these fake reviews, it's particularly disheartening because, yeah, I think reporting it as you see it is always good. Beyond that, it's. It's really really hard and I know Amazon are tackling it but, as I said, they've almost created a problem in doing that for the people who are getting their reviews legitimately, because it is so hard. And that's one thing that clients ask me about all the time and I think the biggest it's not the biggest issue, but a big issue for a lot of sellers, particularly new sellers. It's just getting reviews. It's a big ask.

Speaker 1: 26:14

People find it hard to do. It's something I struggle with as a writer, as a podcaster hint, hint, everybody listening to this it will be very easy for you to go and write me a review. The links are right there in your show notes. But the friction of actually doing that and clicking over Maybe it's something that we could think about. As we're recording this at the end of November, we've just had Thanksgiving in many parts of the world. The best way to thank an independent seller, writer, creator, anybody who you felt well-served by this year. You can actually be part of that, fighting back against the tide of fake reviews and express your gratitude at the same time, for free, by popping over and finding out. They'll be away right, even though Amazon doesn't send the emails anymore, it's there on the page writing a review.

Speaker 2: 27:07

It is. If you go into your orders, you can do that. That's such a lovely idea, I think. An extra issue on Amazon and I think it's worth pointing out is that a lot of people, when they buy on Amazon, don't even always realize they're buying from a small business. Yes, lots of businesses now have this small business badge, but because of the way the platform is, it's a bit more impersonal. I feel like this is only anecdotal, but I'm told from sellers that they get better reviews. I have some sellers who sell on Amazon and Etsy, for example. I think on Etsy, people get this is a small business, it's often handmade and they're much more inclined to leave reviews. But because Amazon is this giant platform and also because lots of us, especially with Christmas coming up maybe 10 things in the basket or whatever, but multiple things leaving reviews can feel like a bit of a slow con to say it does feel very different to Etsy, doesn't it?

Speaker 1: 27:58

Or eBay, where you feel very connected with that personal profile and there's probably a picture or a profile page where you can relate to that seller. A lot more People very rarely visit author pages on Amazon product sellers. I don't know, I think maybe that's what we're all buying into, isn't it? It's the Amazon experience, as you said, the customer service and being able to return things or having correct things picked up and all of that second to none. But we sacrifice a bit of that personal touch maybe.

Speaker 2: 28:29

I think so. Something I recommend to anyone selling on Amazon is, where you can, to add a bit of personality to your listings. You have space to talk about your products, but you also have a little bit of space to talk about your brands and your vision, maybe your values, why you start or all of these things you can actually include in your product listing and you'll see, if you look on Amazon now, that much more sellers are doing that. The listings now aren't just a description of what this product is, but the brands themselves are coming through a lot more, and I think that's really important. It started with a lot of the bigger brands doing that, but small brands can do that as well. You can access all the same tools. You just need a trademark, as I mentioned earlier, and to sign up to the brand registry program, and then you can share a lot more information on your listings. I do recommend that because it's nice for people to have a sense of who they're buying from. Not all my clients like this, but some of them, especially if they're a really small business. I say in the bit about yourself put picture so people can see that you're a person. I think we want to buy from people and we want to buy from small businesses, but we also like the convenience of buying on Amazon. I think if we can get both, I think that's perfect.

Speaker 1: 29:45

Yes, 100%. That's really important insight because I admit I shop on Amazon more than I want to admit even to myself. It's just so easy when you work from home and it all just arrives there, usually the next day. Often I found it frustrating dealing with retailers. I don't know if it's a particular thing here in Spain, but there can be a really frustrating sense of, okay, you haven't got the thing I want, but could you please get back to me about it or could you suggest something else, or could you make it a little bit easy to deal with you? I end up finding myself dealing with brands like Amazon or it's the same with Apple that doesn't feel like a local business, simply because you want that customer service and that reassurance. I think what you're suggesting bring your personality and individuality to that platform, take advantage of that security, that reassurance and that global reach, but inject a little bit of yourself into it as a small business. I really like that. Do you think in terms of the future, we're coming to the end of the year looking towards a new one. I know it's not quite December yet, but it will be when people are listening to or watching this. If you had a crystal ball. What do you think 2024 is going to be like for small business sellers and product sellers on Amazon?

Speaker 2: 31:07

I really hope it's going to be a good year. I've seen, when I look at my own clients, these sales go up and down throughout the course of the year, but things seem to. The sense I'm getting now is that things seem to be on the up. I feel that Amazon is doing a bit more to support small businesses. It's not perfect, by the way. Nothing on Amazon is. It's a really tricky one actually, I have to say. One thing I wouldn't mind saying is sometimes I feel like, because I support small businesses almost saying I help them sell on Amazon Amazon almost feels like it's against small businesses. I believe, for the reasons that I've said, that it actually can be a great opportunity. I think that Amazon is starting to recognize that as well. I feel that, like I said, the small business badge I mentioned is such a small thing, but it's something that differentiates your buying from the small business. I think Amazon is starting to get that. People want to shop small and they don't want to shop necessarily big brands, facist brands. I'm hoping that what we'll see is things continuing to go in that direction and things being made easier for the smaller businesses to sell on Amazon. That's what I'd really would love to see for next year.

Speaker 1: 32:20

Brilliant. Well, let's hope that that's true. Is this an area of business that you would recommend to freelancers to start selling their products on Amazon, or small businesses? If you have a product, is this a good way to go with it?

Speaker 2: 32:34

I think it very much depends on what your product is. It's my really honest answer because I like to be honest and I don't think Amazon is the best marketplace for every business and for every product either, because it's just not where someone would go. So, for example, if you're selling personalized products, I would say you'd probably have better luck on Etsy. I'm not saying don't try Amazon, but I would say if people are looking for a unique gift, in my mind I was going to not on the high street, I was going to Etsy before I went to Amazon. That's not me saying don't try it, but it may or may not be the best match. Also, if you're selling something that's, the market's super saturated, particularly if there are lots of overseas sellers who are selling these products not cheaper. So years ago one of the products I sold was BabyTowels and at the time the towels I was selling were the biggest and the thickest on the market at that time. So we're talking six years ago and I sold them for a premium price because they were a premium product. But when I look on Amazon now I can see because I'm not selling my products anymore I can see people selling really similar products for a lot less than I was able to, because it appears that it's the manufacturers selling them directly and of course that means their costs are lower. So if I was starting a business now, that wouldn't be a product that I would look to sell on Amazon, because I would just look and say you know what, I can't compete on price. I probably can't even compete on quality. I don't think I'll try and while that sounds quite defeatist, I feel like because it's a hard place to get started and because you need to stand out, it's just been really honest. It's not for everyone and, by the way, if anyone listening thinks, oh, I wonder if Amazon would be good for me, I will tell you my life. I'll always tell you very honestly if I think it's a good place or not, because I don't know if that sounds really negative. In a lot of instances I feel like most small businesses that I've worked with this year, their products are a great fit for Amazon, because I think small businesses in particular are quite innovative and their products are often really unique because they've either come out to solve a problem or they're creating something that isn't there already. I can't think of anyone that I've worked with recently where I thought, well, actually you wouldn't be a good fit. Because I just think that entrepreneurs and small businesses are just so creative and because, also, I feel like their products are so personal to them, so much thought and care has gone into. Honestly, I work with people who sell the most amazing things because they're so dedicated. It's their product, it's their idea, it's their business, and I think that's one of the reasons I love working with small businesses. It's very different from a bigger brand, and I'm not saying bigger brands don't have great products, well, that they don't care about their products, but there's something about small businesses that yeah, that passion of an entrepreneur is hard to beat, isn't it, and I think that's why many of us are drawn to this lifestyle.

Speaker 1: 35:19

But you've recently streamlined your business to the point that you're not a seller anymore. You're focusing on supporting other people. So tell me about that shift and that transition and what passion you have for that.

Speaker 2: 35:35

So the shift came about for a few reasons. It was that it all came as lots of things do. You probably hear this a lot now. Covid probably was the trigger and you probably heard this more than once.

Speaker 1: 35:43

It's changed a few things in the world. Let's put it that way.

Speaker 2: 35:47

So for a few reasons I think one after being so isolated for quite a long time and then obviously, working you sell in products is also quite isolating because it was just me working from home, I kind of, as I was around that time I was. The freelancing side of what I was doing was ramping up because a lot more business wanted to get onto Amazon because maybe the shop savers stocked in was closing down or they just wanted a bigger reach. So the freelancing part of my business ramped up and I started thinking actually I really enjoy working with other people, I really enjoy helping other people and I got so much satisfaction from that, more so than the sales that I was getting from my products business. And then also at that time I was looking to change production for my business because my products at that time were mostly made in China. I was trying to move production to Europe and then Brexit happened. That also got hard and it got to the point where the selling product side was getting hard and I wasn't sure that the positives outweighed the negatives anymore. There were lots of delays on production because as factories reopened they're prioritising bigger brands with the larger orders, which makes title sense. And then there were lots of shipping delays and everything just felt really hard. And I just had a look at things and thought you know what, I'm getting much more enjoyment from working with other people, helping them sell their products. I just was getting quite energised from working with other people after years of working mainly in isolation, working on my products, typing away at my blog, and I just thought this is much more rewarding. And also by that point, I think I'd also had this big shift I spoke about where I was like actually I do know what I'm doing. I can consider myself an expert. I've been doing this long enough. It's funny how you have to have this thing in your head where you're sort of like oh, I am an expert now, but I got there anyway, possibly a bit late. I was like you know what I do feel validated. I do feel like I've got something to offer and I'd really like to do that.

Speaker 1: 37:54

Brilliant. Well, we're freelancers. We don't have a manager coming along and giving us an annual performance review and saying OK, vicky, you're ready to graduate to helping other people do this thing now. So here is your new job title. We have to evaluate ourselves, we have to promote ourselves, we have to put ourselves first and we have to recognize what we can and can't do, where our true fulfillment lies, where our zone of excellence is and for you, that's clearly helping other people follow a similar trajectory that you've trodden from the home business, the products, into selling, into scaling and beyond. So this has been a really wonderful journey. With the future as freelance, because you exemplify it so well, we're going to put all your links in the show notes, obviously, but in case anybody is driving, please stop before you take notes or anything. But if anybody is listening right now, where can they get hold of you, vicky, to find out more?

Speaker 2: 38:50

The best place is my website, which is vickywinebagcom. You still might need to look in the show notes because it's quite tricky to spell, but I'm sure if you type it into Google, as it sounds, you'll find me, and I'm on Instagram as well as Vicky Wineberg, uk, and I'm on LinkedIn. Yeah, you can find me everywhere.

Speaker 1: 39:06

Brilliant. Well, I'm sure lots of people are going to do just that as they get through their own Christmas shopping, black Friday madness and all those packages lined up outside. Maybe next year their own products and goods will be part of that pile on everybody's doorsteps with your assistance. Vicky, thanks so much for joining us on the future as freelancers. It's been a real pleasure. Thank you so much. Thank you for listening to the Future as Freelance podcast. We appreciate your time and attention in a busy world and you're busy freelance life. If you enjoyed this episode, please share it with a fellow freelancer and help us grow this movement of independent entrepreneurs. If you rate and review the Future as Freelance in whichever app you're listening to right now, it really helps spread the word and that means we can reach more people who need to hear this message. Together, we can change the world and make sure the future is freelance, don't forget. You can check out all our back episodes from other seasons and learn more over at FutureIsFreelancexyz. We're so grateful, not only for our listeners, but for the contributions of our wonderful guests and for the production and marketing assistance of coffee like media. This is Maya Midlemish, wishing you freelance freedom and happiness until our next show.